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Post by Admin on Mar 19, 2018 11:41:01 GMT
Olivia is the admin this week  |
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Post by Olivia Girdwood on Mar 19, 2018 12:24:55 GMT
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Post by Olivia Girdwood on Mar 20, 2018 12:09:48 GMT
Australian Foreign Minister Julie Bishop made the comment in relation to East Timor that "As good friends and close neighbors, we want Timor Leste to achieve its economic potential" (BBC). According to a Green Left article, though, “The United States, Britain and our own closest neighbor, Australia, placed more importance on their relationship with the Suharto dictatorship than Timorese lives”. Australia supported the take over of East Timor and changed their minds when East Timor gained independence. This may be because Australia realized their mistake and want an economic ally, or to suck up to East Timor in an apology so they can make treaties regarding the oil and gas fields. Just appears that Australia is putting on a fake face for East Timor. There is something fishy about Australia, one of the biggest countries on the planet, agreeing to make a deal with one of the smallest countries, East Timor. Australia could potentially take over East Timor, but whether the UN would allow it would be a separate issue. The UN got involved in East Timor under the Indonesian take over, and helped the country gain independence. East Timor must have some bargaining chip, that is hidden from the public’s eye and only Australia knows about, to be able to even propose such a change in the sea. These proposed changes may make a tension between the two countries. Part of East Timor’s argument, regarding the past agreement, is that “...the two sides agreed on a temporary boundary, but East Timor later argued that deal had been unfairly forced upon them” (BBC1). If they agreed to the boundary how was it forced upon them? Would this be enough to bring the UN in again because of “unfair” treatment? Changing an entire system of oil and gas production will cause a lot more issues than good. The oil and gas already run through Australia, rather than change the system underwater, maybe they could just agree that East Timor is to get a higher percentage of product and revenue than they currently are receiving. East Timor has a set in regards to making these proposals to Australia, but the outcome is very unpredictable.
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Post by Maddy Crighton on Mar 22, 2018 1:38:26 GMT
There has been dispute over the maritime border between Australia and East Timor for decades. However, when a new treaty is being signed towards East Timor’s favor, East Timor is still unhappy. According to ABC, Australia is willing to give East Timor 80% of the income from the oil and gas profits. Australian Foreign Minister, Julie Bishop, made the comment that “As good friends and close neighbours, we want Timor Leste to achieve its economic potential” (BBC). However, with this in mind, before the treaty, Australia was in support of East Timor being ransacked by the Indonesians and did nothing to stop the mass killings that were happening. Now that East Timor has become an independent nation, they are taking back their stance and is attempting to be on good terms. East Timor is right to not be happy with the treaty being negotiated due to the past relationship with Australia. The UN and the United States are also trying to be on good terms with East Timor. This may be an attempt to form a relationship purposely in attempts for East Timor’s new economic state. It is quite odd that such a small country can make a big difference, and reminds me off the saying, “Although she is small, she is fierce.” East Timor recently gained their independence which proves that though they are small, they will keep fighting for what they believe in and what they want. The process of new relations between Australia and East Timor will ultimately change their relations, but not in a negative way. Australia is already willing to give 80% of the profits away, I have no doubt that they won’t end up giving more profits away. East Timor is determined and will get their deal in the end. I do not believe it will come to any rational events, but more so of another treaty.
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Post by Makayla Rieder on Mar 22, 2018 17:29:53 GMT
Australia and East Timor seem to be acting like they like each other and support each other but they really don’t. East Timor is struggling and needs all the help and support they could get, and Australia seems like it wants to help, but they actually don’t. Australia just kind of ignored Timor Leste when they needed them most and switched who they were supporting in the fight. Maybe they are supporting things only to make themselves look good for a time and then change later on when they can. It seems that they supported the underdog for a minute and then switched it around once a bigger nation came into play. They wanted to support the people they thought would be in power after the Indonesians invaded. Larger countries stepped in to support Timor-Leste, and maybe it isn’t very risky standing up for a small country about oil. They saw the small country getting beaten down by a big world power and wanted to help, maybe for publicity and just to be able to say that they did a good deed, but nevertheless; they did seem to help. With all these world powers backing up Timor Leste, did Australia really have any other options than to bend to their command and negotiate? Being against a powerful countries and associations would not be in the best interest for anybody, and maybe that’s why Australia agreed to change its ways a bit. I think that Timor Leste should be given most of the rights to Greater Sunrise, considering they’re such a small country and need a good source of income to keep going. As the Multinational Monitor quoted from the Timorese President “This is a question of life or death.” The small country doesn’t really have any big sources of income other than oil, and they’re running out of it in the places they have already established, so they need this deal in order to survive as a country. Australia is already well established and has lots of resources of income, so why not help a small country get on its feet when you can? Australia doesn’t absolutely need rights to Greater Sunrise, but Timor Leste needs to be able to live with some kind of revenue, and without that oil field; they might not be able to o that.
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Post by Meghan Miller on Mar 22, 2018 19:55:58 GMT
The East Timor and Australian maritime border dispute is strictly about economic control of the Greater Sunrise gas fields. The change in support stems from the public exposure to the situation and the need for good relations to get the most economic benefits from the relation with East Timor. After the 1999 referendum more notice was placed on East Timor by international groups, Green Left .ord said that “The reconstruction of Timor Leste began when the UN formed its peacekeeping mission, UNTAET” allowing for more international attention on the small country. More international attention also meant that more countries had to be wary of their relation with East Timor and that “Several countries . . . suddenly became "friends" in the reconstruction process”(greenleft.org). The Australian government also wants to support East Timor because they want the economic negotiation to go in their favor. Good relations can lead to a more friendly negotiation and Australia is at a risk of losing “the $25 billion also going to local jobs in Darwin and producing tax revenue” (abc.net). Australia is preserving their image and economic interest by ‘supporting’ East Timor.
The interference from other countries and East Timor’s bargaining power rests on two things; oil and natural gas. Most of the world is dependent on oil and natural gas, as seen by the fight over those resources in the Middle East. Because of East Timor’s control over a decent part of the Greater Sunrise gas fields and other, smaller fields in the Timor sea. East Timor has a bargaining chip with big companies that supply oil and natural gas to many large countries,“ Timor-Leste's government believes it can convince the companies to pipe the gas the shorter distance to Timor-Leste”(multinationalmonitor.org). East Timor has economic advantages that give them leverage in international relations, specifically with the Australian dispute. The East Timor-Australian agreement is a big win for smaller countries and is a bright spot in the view of international news.
My question: Do you believe that East Timor’s ‘victory’ in negotiations will pave the way for smaller countries to get a more fair portion of economic resources?
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Post by Barbie Cessar on Mar 23, 2018 0:24:47 GMT
Receiving at least 70% of the oil field is in favor of East Timor who relies heavily on oil and gas for its economy. Which is a benefit that some citizens of East Timor believe they are deserve from their independence. "Xanana Gusmao, the former prime minister states, “Just as we fought so hard and suffered so much for our independence, Timor-Leste will not rest until we have our sovereign rights over both land and sea." Shortly after East Timor's independence proclamation, Indonesia invaded the nation. This invasion lasted a whole 24 years until the UN referendum in 1999. Many innocent lives could have been saved if the UN was faster in resolving the conflict or if neighboring countries contributed to aiding East Timor. During this time most countries were silent and did not intervene, not even Australia who now claims to be good friends with East Timor. Australia must care more about their global relations than the hundreds of thousands of people that were killed during the invasion. Seeing the situation from Australia’s perspective, no other country at this time was aiding the on of the poorest country in the world. In greater detail, “They did not want this to be achieved by force, however, but considered that it should be by an act of genuine free choice.” (.nationalobserver.net) Australia may have not agreed with the brutal invasion but they were not willing to sacrifice foreign relations, trade, and were not willing to have Indonesia threaten their own country. I think that giving East Timor the maritime border in the Timor Sea is Australia’s way of making up for not intervening in the invasion. Australia is in favor of this change because it benefits their foreign relations and it doesn't put their country in danger. Here is a website I used to better understand the foreign relationship of Australia with Indonesia during the invasion in the 1970s. www.nationalobserver.net/2000_winter_108.htm |
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Post by Maya Borland on Mar 23, 2018 1:49:14 GMT
Since East Timor has gained their independence they are starting to grow their economy. The oil field under the sea would really star helping the growth of the economy. That is why Timor is fighting for a better Maritime treaty with Australia so that they can have more control over the oil fields. Without getting more control over the fields Timor only, “reserves 90% of petroleum revenue.” This is why Timor gained their independence back in 1999 so that they could grow. If they do not fight for more control and equality what was the reason for getting their independence. If this argument for control of oil fields continues then I believe that the relationship between Australia and Timor will become interesting. Depending if Timor requires more control over the oil fields then Australia will feel they have lesser authority. Not to mention if Timor has more control of oil then not only can they grow their economy and fuel their Workforce they can also start selling the oil and gas. Even though Timor is a small country now in 10 years they could be a very big successful country with a large oil and gas field. I believe that the US and Britain are trying to befriend Timor in order to buy their natural oil and gas resources. Since Timor is new to the oil industry new buyers will not have to fight other countries for oil. Even though East Timor is a small country now they have nothing to lose but everything to gain. I believe that is why they are pushing for all these demands on the oil fields. The big question is if Timor pushes for two main demands on the oil field will Austria just take away their rights or just take over their country?
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Post by Brooke Gentile on Mar 23, 2018 2:33:41 GMT
"East Timor, one of the world's poorest nations, will now gain the majority of any future revenue"(BBC). After years of pain and fighting they are finally getting what they deserve. Not even a month after they gained independence in 1975 the Suharto dictatorship in Indonesia used all its military firepower to invade Timor Leste. This invasion lasted a long and painful 24 years before the UN referendum in 1999. Their people were tortured and slaughtered, which ended up bringing people together in order to win back their independence (Green Left). During this time Australia sat back and did nothing to help East Timor, but now claims to be on their side and want to support them by saying “As good friends and close neighbors, we want Timor Leste to achieve its economic potential” (BBC). One might ask however, where was this mentality while they were being slaughtered and and tortured? Australia might be only in this to make themselves look good, and to grant them economic and political gain. Recently Australia was in the process of working out a deal with East Timor regarding the profits from the oil and gas. Timor continues to push the limits of Australia and ask for more and more out of this new deal. I agree that they still need to fight for more rights and more control over the oil fields and the gas, because if they don't they are essentially "giving up" on their selves. Australia however was willing to give Timor an astounding 80% of the oil and gas, which is extremely surprising to many. This clearly shows that Australia is trying very hard to be on good terms with Timor, buy why? Is it because they actually want to do good and help their "good friends" out? Or is it simply because there is an underlying reason that we simply cannot see, and they will soon pull the rug out from East Timor before we know it.
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Post by Brooke Gentile on Mar 23, 2018 2:34:09 GMT
"East Timor, one of the world's poorest nations, will now gain the majority of any future revenue"(BBC). After years of pain and fighting they are finally getting what they deserve. Not even a month after they gained independence in 1975 the Suharto dictatorship in Indonesia used all its military firepower to invade Timor Leste. This invasion lasted a long and painful 24 years before the UN referendum in 1999. Their people were tortured and slaughtered, which ended up bringing people together in order to win back their independence (Green Left). During this time Australia sat back and did nothing to help East Timor, but now claims to be on their side and want to support them by saying “As good friends and close neighbors, we want Timor Leste to achieve its economic potential” (BBC). One might ask however, where was this mentality while they were being slaughtered and and tortured? Australia might be only in this to make themselves look good, and to grant them economic and political gain. Recently Australia was in the process of working out a deal with East Timor regarding the profits from the oil and gas. Timor continues to push the limits of Australia and ask for more and more out of this new deal. I agree that they still need to fight for more rights and more control over the oil fields and the gas, because if they don't they are essentially "giving up" on their selves. Australia however was willing to give Timor an astounding 80% of the oil and gas, which is extremely surprising to many. This clearly shows that Australia is trying very hard to be on good terms with Timor, buy why? Is it because they actually want to do good and help their "good friends" out? Or is it simply because there is an underlying reason that we simply cannot see, and they will soon pull the rug out from East Timor before we know it.
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Post by Laura Gutauskas on Mar 23, 2018 3:06:16 GMT
A possible reason for Australia almost seamlessly handing over the means of making higher profits through oil mining could be that they are making a more forceful internal effort in replacing their energy sources with renewable ones. By forceful, I mean if they take away a portion of this commodity, then they’re pressuring themselves to work harder towards their Renewable Energy Target of 20% by 2020. Then again, this is too much of an honorable scenario considering Australia’s obvious greed trickery since they still want the oil to be processed in Darwin which would give the entire continent many more benefits than East Timor. The U.N. didn’t do as much as they could’ve for Timor; “The problems we see today are related to the "quick fix" foundation put in place by UNTAET” (Greenleft). They left a small impact on Timor in order to make it seem like they attempted to mend things for another nation so as to look good in the eyes of others, although they only threw it together poorly and really didn’t help them much at all. Timor’s incessant efforts to make amends to the previous oil deal has been the only leverage in convincing Australia; "Just as we fought so hard and suffered so much for our independence, Timor-Leste will not rest until we have our sovereign rights over both land and sea" (bbc). They’ve continued to fight for fairness, despite that outcome not always being guaranteed. This could better the standing that Australia has with Timor if the oil ends up being processed on the island instead, otherwise it will tear them apart even more. Timor is likely to keep fighting against the U.N. and Australia if they do not meet this single condition since, “That is a deal-breaker for East Timor, which says it will take a 70/30 split if the oil and gas comes to East Timor” instead of an 80/20 split in Darwin (abc). A 70/30 split is reasonable enough for both areas since Australia doesn’t have to solely rely on this one area for oil resources unlike Timor who desperately needs it to see growth.
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Post by Maya French on Mar 23, 2018 3:16:46 GMT
When Julie Bishop, the Australian Foreign Minister said called the East Timor "good friends and close neighbours” she was simply putting on a show for the media. In reading this discussion board I could not help but notice that East Timor had been used and practically bullied for decades but suddenly had a voice and was being taken care of when the global media began to shine its light on the conflict. It is almost as if Australia was the big bully, taking advantage of how weak East Timor is and using that to gain more control over The Greater Sunrise oil bed. Then when measures were taken on the international levels and Australia was at risk of being exposed, they picked East Timor up off the ground, dusted off their shirt and started to play nice so they did not get in trouble. This is just another typical situation where the powerful country takes advantage of the weaker one. I specifically found the views of Mericio Akara, who wrote for the Green Left to be interesting. Akara stated ”The continuing resistance forced the hand of the international community to intervene in Timor Leste.”, resistance referring to that of the people of East Timor. It is absurd that when people of a smaller country are being killed and tortured it is no cause for alarm but the intense resistance is what caught the eye of the international community. Akara also points out that ”The United States, Britain and our own closest neighbour, Australia, placed more importance on their relationship with the Suharto dictatorship than Timorese lives. Documents and eyewitnesses prove these countries supported and aided the invasion and occupation of our country.” And then she goes on to explain how these such countries were “friends” during the rebuilding process in East Timor. This is likely going to all be an elaborate show and although Australia and these other countries will play nice with the international community is watching, as soon as they turn their back the countries will gang up on East Timor. This weak, little country has a large share of an extremely valuable resource, the poor little guy does not stand a chance.
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Post by RickyMineo on Mar 23, 2018 3:44:54 GMT
East Timor's relationship with Australia is interesting because it seems to be "As good as friends, as close as neighbors"(BBC) despite their past. Australia completely disregarded East Timor when Indonesia invaded in 1975. East Timor had just been granted independence and Indonesia did not hesitate to jump in to the new country. Indonesia invaded and was present in East Timor killing off the people that lived there for 24 years until the UN Referendum in 1999. Currently, East Timor is a struggling nation that only seems drawn towards Australia because they're in need of a country they can get supported by. Timor and Australia have created a deal to allow Timor to control about 70-80% of the oil fields. This is huge because East Timor's economy is strongly based around gas and oil. Australia is completely willing to give up the oil to help Timor. Is Australia allowing Timor to have control of the oil because they are trying to make up for their failure to assist them when they needed it in the 1970's until 1999. |
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Post by Maddy Crighton on Mar 23, 2018 12:31:29 GMT
brooke I totally agree with you that Australia seems like they have underlying motives and only are being nice to East Timor to make up for their past. They are most likely not doing it out of the kindness of their hearts, but to have access to their economics and be allies. However, if I were East Timor, I would not have any relations with Australia besides the border treaty.
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Post by Olivia Girdwood on Mar 23, 2018 13:49:05 GMT
@meghan
I do not believe this this will pave the way for smaller countries. The UN has not stepped in in other cases of murders and killings. For example Rwanda or the Rhoyinga. The difference in this case was the oil and gas fields. No other country has access to resources like East Timor does. The UN, as well as Australia and the other countries who suddenly became friends, only care for themselves and what betters themselves.
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